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Yes, maybe they could replace the whole Heliconiini tip with your
tree (what to do about missing species?). Interestingly, there are
some designated subspecies that are shown grouped as polytomies
within species e.g. H. melpomene.<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 19/09/2015 08:13, Krzysztof Kozak
wrote:<br>
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cite="mid:CAKidaieY04XVphtc8GYxbcEpzk1aTUVpVPafR-oKfins2wFo8Q@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
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<div dir="ltr">Hi,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Having looked at their discussion group, there are some
good systematists involved. I will just ask if I could simply
upload a proper tree for Heliconiini, or would they want me to
hack through all the taxonomy...</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Cheers,</div>
<div>Chris</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div class="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>__</div>
Chris Kozak<br>
<div><br>
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<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Sep 19, 2015 at 12:41 PM,
Krzysztof Kozak <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:kmkozak87@gmail.com" target="_blank">kmkozak87@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Hello,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Why not just send them our phylogenies and ask if
they can stitch those in instead? Maybe it could be
corrected relatively painlessly. Eve if only one study
ends up using this down the line, it may be good to have
quality information?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Cheers,</div>
<div>Chris</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>__</div>
Chris Kozak<br>
<div><br>
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<div class="h5">
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Sep 19, 2015 at 9:45
AM, Marianne Elias <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:melias2008@gmail.com"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:melias2008@gmail.com">melias2008@gmail.com</a></a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div>Well, Ithomiini are also highly
polytomous and comprise over 1500 'species',
some of which are subspecies, but other seem
to come out from nowhere (perhaps Keith W
knows what they all are). Some species names
are also attributed to the wrong genus. It
seems that they've datamined the
litterature, the web and databases and made
a collection of names, most of which are
obsolete, wrong and redundant. I don't see
the point of doing this, all the more as
there's already a tree of life project (<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://tolweb.org" target="_blank">tolweb.org</a>)
with reasonable phylogenies (though not
always up-to-date, but we should only blame
ourselves for our groups of interest!).<br>
<br>
</div>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
</div>
Marianne<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div>
<div>On Sat, Sep 19, 2015 at 3:38 AM, James
Mallet <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:jmallet@oeb.harvard.edu"
target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jmallet@oeb.harvard.edu">jmallet@oeb.harvard.edu</a></a>></span>
wrote:<br>
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style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<div>
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Interesting project idea, a Wikipedia
for phylogeny, and perhaps I shouldn't
knock it.<br>
<br>
But does anyone feel like correcting
this polytomy in <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opentreeoflife.org"
target="_blank">opentreeoflife.org</a>?
<br>
<b><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://tree.opentreeoflife.org/opentree/opentree3.0@1766047/Heliconiini"
target="_blank">https://tree.opentreeoflife.org/opentree/opentree3.0@1766047/Heliconiini</a></b><br>
<br>
I counted 815 "species" in the genus <i>Heliconius
</i>on this site, including <i>Heliconius
wucherpfennigi</i> which is a named
aberration of a form of a subspecies
of "<i>Heliconius clytia</i>" which is
thought today to be a synonym of <i>Heliconius
wallacei</i>! <br>
<br>
No wonder they claim to have 2.3
million species! I wonder how many
other groups have spurious species
like this!<br>
<br>
Best wishes, Jim<span><font
color="#888888"><br>
<pre cols="72">--
James Mallet
Organismic & Evolutionary Biology
Harvard University
16 Divinity Avenue - BioLabs
Cambridge, MA 02138
USA tel: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:%2B%281%29617-496-5350" value="+16174965350" target="_blank">+(1)617-496-5350</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.oeb.harvard.edu/mallet/" target="_blank">www.oeb.harvard.edu/mallet/</a></pre>
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<span>_______________________________________________<br>
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<span><font color="#888888"><br>
<br clear="all">
<br>
-- <br>
<div>Marianne Elias<br>
CNRS Researcher<br>
UMR 7205 - CNRS<br>
Museum National d'Histoire Naturelle<br>
45 rue Buffon, CP50, 75005 Paris<br>
phone: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%2B33%201%2040%2079%2037%2090"
value="+33140793790" target="_blank">+33
1 40 79 37 90</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.mnhn.fr/oseb/elias-marianne,279"
target="_blank">http://www.mnhn.fr/oseb/elias-marianne,279</a><br>
<br>
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<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
James Mallet
Organismic & Evolutionary Biology
Harvard University
16 Divinity Avenue - BioLabs
Cambridge, MA 02138
USA tel: +(1)617-496-5350
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.oeb.harvard.edu/mallet/">www.oeb.harvard.edu/mallet/</a></pre>
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